Please see the following written replies from the Environment Portfolio Holder to our three questions about Crab Hill, as given at the Environment PDS Committee meeting on 15 March 2018.
From Mr Clive Lees, Chairman, Ravensbourne Valley Preservation Society
1. Further to your site visit to Crab Hill we would be grateful to receive an update on the Council’s plans to improve the Crab Hill parking scheme and mitigate the serious knock-on effects both in Crab Hill and in neighbouring roads.
Parking in this area is to be reviewed later in 2018. In the meantime, consideration is being given to reducing the cost of all day parking in the Pay by Phone bays, to encourage a full take up of the available spaces.
2. Notwithstanding the above, would the Council undertake to immediately improve the contradictory and inadequate signage in respect of over-height lorries diverted away from the Shortlands railway bridge down Ravensbourne Avenue?
I have asked the traffic engineers to correct the signage so that HGV drivers will be clear of where the diversionary route goes.
3. Notwithstanding 1) above, would the Council immediately consider the replacement of the parking bay outside 119 Foxgrove Road with single/double yellow lines in order that there be sufficient road space for very large vehicles to exit Downs Hill turning left into Foxgrove Road?
This junction is currently being looked at for improvement as it forms part of the planned Quietway Route from Bromley to Lower Sydenham. The junction has a wide radius, with a narrow island in the centre, which does not provide a good quality pedestrian crossing facility and risks left hand collisions between cyclists and motor vehicles. We are therefore proposing to ask TfL for funding for a minor intervention to tighten the junction radii to reduce the speed of vehicles travelling through the junction and reconfigure the island to improve the facilities for pedestrians crossing the mouth of the junction. This would also enable us to improve the appearance of this junction and possibly plant new trees. As part of this design work consideration will be given to turning circles and yellow lines will be recommended where needed. Changes to facilitate the Quietway should also have an effect of reducing speeds through this junction.
Please see the answers to the following questions which we raised with Bromley council. This is a bit disappointing, including them not being aware of the accident requiring a helicopter for the injured. The point about the trains is interesting though. The portfolio holder, Councillor William Huntington-Thresher, has kindly offered to meet us. Please send any thoughts to Clive Lees.
From Clive Lees, Chairman, Ravensbourne Valley Preservation Society
1. The new(ish) Crab Hill Pay and Display Scheme is unsatisfactory, underutilised and above all promotes unsafe traffic conditions together with bottlenecks caused by displaced parking. Is the Portfolio Holder aware of these shortcomings?
It is acknowledged that the pay by mobile bays are not fully utilised at present and I will address this in my answer to your second question. In respect to parking displacement, where new parking restrictions are installed there will always be a certain level of displacement to unrestricted roads and these are a consideration when officers are planning a design. Regardless of any parking schemes, commuter parking can be witnessed in many roads within the borough especially where demand is high due to nearby facilities such as railway stations, hospitals, schools, businesses and shops.
Whilst we appreciate that parking can result in some drivers (at times) needing to give way to on-coming vehicles, we do not consider this to create too many problems or issues. Indeed, parked cars often reduce the speed of passing traffic. Where complaints regarding congestion and pinch points were regularly reported prior to installation of the scheme this is no longer the case. We have also looked into the accident data we receive from the Police regarding accidents in any particular location as this provides additional, useful information. The latest police records show that there have been no collisions resulting in personal injury in locations in and around Crab Hill the last three years. (Please note that the Police only record accidents where a personal injury has occurred, they do not record damage to vehicle only accidents, therefore, it is not possible to accurately record these types of incidences). We have also reviewed additional data for accident reports in the same area over the last 19 years and highlighted that there were three slight personal injury incidents in July 2002, June 2004 and Feb 2005 but nothing at all since.
2. Regarding the above mentioned scheme, residents have long been promised a review but this has not happened. Would the Council now undertake an immediate review of the scheme, in tandem with residents and RVPS, with the intention of remedying its serious shortcomings?
With regard to a review of the scheme, officers were giving the scheme time to develop a pattern of use before a review was undertaken. Since that time the Council has been made aware that there is a plan to increase the frequency of rail services provided at Ravensbourne Station which may have an effect on the parking demand locally. It would therefore be remiss to undertake any costly changes and consultations before these details have been established. Precise timeframes for confirmation and implementation of these plans have not yet been provided to the Council, but we expect them to occur this calendar year. I am happy to meet with RVPS to discuss more fully.
According to a notice published in The Gazette on 21 September 2016. The following orders came into operation on 26 September 2016:
- The Bromley (Waiting and Loading Restriction) Order 2003 (Amendment No. 163) Order 2016
- The Bromley (Controlled Parking) (On Street Places) Order 2004 (Amendment No. 88) Order 2016
- The Bromley (Free Parking Places) (Disabled Persons) Order 2003 (Amendment No. 53) Order 2016
- The Bromley (Free Parking Places) (Time Restricted) Order 1997 (Amendment No. 56) Revocation Order 2016 (Crab Hill, Beckenham, Crescent Way, Orpington, Mottingham Road, Mottingham, Red Lodge Road, West Wickham
A reminder that any person wishing to object to the Crab Hill, Beckenham (Ravensbourne station) pay-by-mobile parking scheme should do so no later than 31 August 2016.
Some additional information on the Crab Hill parking follows.
Martin Trodden, a resident of Crab Hill, met with Paul Nevard from Bromley Council on site along with fellow resident Dave Wiltshire and Andrew Storey (RVPS). On the whole they found the meeting constructive and Bromley was open to consultation, although not all items have been reflected.
The final design is the revised scheme following this meeting, on which our representatives have made the following comments:
- The original scheme was for all day payment Monday to Saturday. We argued that Saturday was not relevant as there was not significant parking and most people parking were park users. Residents’ visitors would also be penalised. The revised scheme is now only Monday to Friday.
- We argued for a more limited time period, such 12.00 to 14.00 to deter all day commuters, similar to Shortlands. Bromley did not take this on board and it is 8.30 a.m to 6.30 p.m. 40p per hour, max daily charge £2.40.
- We argued for a number of no charge, limited time bays (eg. max stay 2 hours) by the park entrance. This is not reflected in the revised scheme although there are quite of a number of free bays further up the road.
- We argued for residents’ and residents’ visitors permits. Bromley does not propose to offer residents permits.
- The revised scheme has additional yellow lines and passing points. It was agreed that there needs to be a balance of parked cars to slow traffic but enough passing points to prevent gridlock. The revised scheme appears to be improved in this regard. This needs to be monitored and Bromley confirmed they will be open to change if needed.
- There will be no coin machines. All payment will need to be made by phone or app. Signs will be attached to lampposts. As a result there does not appear to be concern in relation to street furniture and the conservation area.
- We highlighted the need for a pull in/drop-off area in front of the station as currently cars mount the pavement and grass areas. The revised scheme appears to include this for two cars.
The Council of the London Borough of Bromley has given notice that it proposes to make orders under Sections 6, 45, 46, 49 and 124 and Part IV of Schedule 9 to the Road Traffic Regulation Act 1984 (as amended) and all other enabling powers.
The effect of the Orders would be to:
(a) introduce waiting restrictions as specified in the Schedule to this notice;
(b) introduce Pay by Mobile parking places as specified in the Schedule to this notice; and
(c) introduce free parking places as specified in the Schedule to this notice.
Details of prohibitions and exemptions for certain vehicles and persons are contained in the original Orders.
A copy of the proposed orders, of the plans of the schemes and of the Council's statement of reasons for proposing to make the Orders can be inspected during normal office hours on Mondays to Fridays at Bromley Civic Centre. Any person wishing to object should send a statement in writing of their objection and the grounds thereof to the Executive Director of Environment and Community Services, Civic Centre, Stockwell Close, Bromley, BR1 3UH, quoting reference ADE(TP)/RP/T100/639 not later than 31 August 2016. Under the provisions of the Local Government (Access to Information) Act 1985, any comments received may be open to public inspection.
WAITING RESTRICTIONS: No Waiting At Any Time
CRAB HILL, Beckenham, (a) the north and west sides, from the western kerbline of Ravensbourne Avenue westwards to a point 5m south of a point opposite the northern boundary of No. 6; (b) the south and east sides, (i) from a point 8m south west of the common boundary of No. 4a & 'Pine View' southwards to a point 8m south of the common boundary of 'Pine View' & No. 6; (ii) from a point 6m south of the common boundary of Nos. 10 & 12 southwards to its junction with Downs Hill.
DOWNS HILL, Bromley, (a) the west side, from the south eastern kerbline of Foxgrove Road southwards to a point 2m north of a point opposite the northern boundary of No. 44; (b) the east side, from its junction with Crab Hill southwards to the northern boundary of No. 44.
FOXGROVE ROAD, Beckenham, (a) the north side, from a point 10m south west of the common boundary of Nos. 113 & 115 north eastwards to a point 4.5m north east of the common boundary of Nos. 115 & 117; (b) the south side, from the western kerbline of Downs Hill south westwards to a point 3m north east of the common boundary of Nos. 62 & 64.
RAVENSBOURNE AVENUE, Bromley, (a) the west side, from a point 5.5m north of the northern kerbline of Crab Hill southwards to the party wall of Nos. 245 & 247; (b) the east side, from a point 10m south of the southern kerbline of Ravensmead Road northwards to a point 4.5m north of a point opposite the northern kerbline of Crab Hill.
PAY BY MOBILE PARKING PLACES
Pay by Mobile parking between B.30am and 6.30pm on Mondays to Fridays inclusive, except Public Holidays and Sank Holidays. 40p per hour. No maximum stay. Maximum charge £2.60 for stays over 4 hours:-
CRAB HILL, Beckenham, (a) the north side, from a point 16m west of the western kerb line of Ravensbourne Avenue westwards to a point 3m north of the common boundary of 'Downside' and 'Larchmont' (32 parking spaces);
(b) the south side, from a point 6m west of the eastern boundary of No. 2 westwards to a point 5m south of the common boundary of Nos. 6 & 8 (13 parking spaces).
FREE PARKING PLACES
CRAB HILL, Beckenham, (a) the west side, (i) from a point 1 m south of the common boundary of 'Downside' and 'Larchmont' southwards for a distance of 13m (approx. 3 parking spaces); (ii) from a point 2m south of the common boundary of 'Downside' and 'Hillary Mount' southwards for a distance of 16m (3 parking spaces); (iii) from a point 3m south of the common boundary of 'Hillary Mount' and 'Dark Pines' southwards for a distance of 15m (3 parking spaces); (b) the east side, from a point 4m south of the common boundary of Nos. 8 & 10 southwards for a distance of 17m (3 parking spaces).
FOXGROVE ROAD, Beckenham, the north west side, (i) from a point 4m north east of the common boundary of Nos. 117 & 119 north eastwards for a distance of 10m (2 parking spaces); (ii) from a point 4m north east of the common boundary of Nos. 115 & 117 north eastwards for a distance of 10m (2 parking spaces).
RAVENSBOURNE AVENUE, Bromley, (a) the east side, from a point 10m north of the northern kerbline of Ravensmead Road northwards to a point 14m south of a point opposite the southern kerbline of Crab Hill (approx. 7 parking spaces); (b) the west side, from the party wall of Nos. 247 & 249 northwards to the northern flank wall of No. 285 (approx. 7 parking spaces).
Residents of Downs Hill will be pleased to note that the restrictions in their street are minimal, and displaced traffic will inevitably park in their street once the orders are in place.
You will see from the attached plan that there is:
- extended and new double yellow at Crab Hill / Ravensbourne Avenue junction,
- a pull-in bay in front of the station to allow drop offs easier,
- removal of parking on the worst of the bend, and
- extended double yellows around the junction with Downs Hill.
The parking restrictions will now only be Monday to Friday, allowing free parking on Saturday - particularly good for users of Beckenham Place Park.